Could it get any more fake than this?

[KurtS]

Could it get any more fake than this? I suppose if it were a "coin" crayoned on a circle of cardboard, that would be more telling. 



A fellow collector pointed this out on Ebay Australia

Sadly, this coin realized AU $152.50, and conveniently with "User ID kept private". Darn! 

If people are still being fooled by pressure-cast copies, just wait until those die-struck fakes hit eBay en masse.
As a service to collectors, forums could use workshops on detecting cast fakes in the least.
The die-struck fakes will be a tougher call.

[Nighthawk]

KurtS, I just hope you were'nt the one who paid the $152.50.... you took a nice photo of the coin though!

[KurtS]

Lol...if that were my coin, I'd use it for a paperweight or coaster for a cup of espresso. 

[Erik]

Please, I good understand ? This beautifull coin is false ?    It is very very nice coin....  and under cup of esspreso ?   If I could to put this coin in my collection then it will be my treasure.   

[KurtS]

Erik, yes...that one is a pressure-cast fake. The mushy, low-relief details are one clue, as is the faked wear. On the reverse, the pitting in the shield looks like bubbles created during the casting process. The denticles should be better defined, even with wear.

This is the kind of coin one finds in Chinatown here for $1, but this seller has made off with somebody's $152.50. 
I have no problem with these being sold as copies, but not when fraud is involved.

For a contrast, here's what a genuine 1799 looks like in XF40 (the plastic edges are from the holder).


Source: Heritage Auctions

[Erik]

Yes, I already uderstand. He is thief  They are really very similar coins. It is fortune that I haven´t money because I yet didn´t see really different.  I think that this copy is also very nice and 1 dollar is very good price. I think in Slovakia maybe this copy expensive but I don´t know price of coins. Maybe I sometimes obtain this coin in future. This coin is called Morgan dollar ? Or is it only similar ?

[Nighthawk]

It's known as a Draped Bust, Heraldic Eagle Dollar! 

[scottishmoney]

This is the example that resides in my Harem, she is named Anne.  I brought her into my harem because she is the only one that has not had surgery, been re-tanned etc.  She is an all original lovely girl.

[Nighthawk]

Lovely, indeed!

[KurtS]

Scottishmoney, the original toning is beautiful on that one! 

Maybe I sometimes obtain this coin in future.

Just for fun, I could probably find a copy for you at a local market and mail it to you sometime. 

[Erik]

It is nice from you. 

[ElleKitty]

Could it get any more fake? Yes, probably so. If I can recognise a coin right off that it's a fake, then it's a bad fake.  This ... object came to me in a bulk lot.  I suppose I didn't pay anything for it, since there were lots of really nice coins in the bag with it.  It's obviously a sand-cast, and the weight is so light you can tell by holding it.  I don't like holding it though, as I'm pretty certain there is a high content of lead in the metal.  It makes a really good pencil!

[KurtS]

"It makes a really good pencil!"

Wow, that's a fun one! I imagine it had some gold-colored wash originally.
It sounds like it's a tin or pewter alloy...maybe an old fake? 

[ElleKitty]

It might be tin or pewter.  I haven't had it analyzed, though.  I've become quite fond of my little fake Vicky.  It could be  an older copy, although I don't think it's quite as old as to be a contemporary forgery.  That would be neat though!  It still has numismatic value even if it is a copy.

[Nighthawk]

I understand there are a lot of fakes out there, some on ebay, too! I'm very leary about purchasing stuff on ebay from someone in China, or going on ebay from some other country. This little item was picked up by a friend of mine some years ago on a trip to China, supposing it was a genuine U.S. silver eagle. Two problems with this coin: Too lightweight, and the DATE! Good thing he didn't pay a lot for it!

[scottishmoney]

'Cept there is no lead in a pencil, it is graphite, and a lot more useful than the lead from that Chinese fake.  But... Chinese fakes have gotten much better than the examples shown here.  Sure there are some lousy fakes that are obvious, but there are lately many much better ones coming into the market.

[Nighthawk]

Fake "1905" dated silver eagle (reverse)

[longnine009]

If people are still being fooled by pressure-cast copies, just wait until those die-struck fakes hit eBay en masse.
As a service to collectors, forums could use workshops on detecting cast fakes in the least.
The die-struck fakes will be a tougher call.

I agree entirely, but in the U.S we have, IMO, a couple of dirty little family secrets they don't want coming out. "They" being the big money folks in our "industry."   

First, you can't stop the supply of *anything* as long as the demand and profit is there. The U.S "war on drugs"  for the last 30 years has proven that. You reduce supply by first reducing the demand and thus the profit. Supply will stop on it's own once there's no money to be made. Not a lot of altruism in black markets. 

But now how many ways are there to stop the demand for fake coins and now fake coins in fake slabs? Demand for fakes would fall off to nil if  collectors learned to spot them and stop buying them. But their efforts to learn authentication, assuming that they actually want to, which I doubt, only highlights the fact that the problem is there in the first place. We don't want to scare off new collectors, speculators and investors now do we? Why, wallstreet will be here any day now dumping billions into investment grade slabs, we don't want to scare them away. That's dirty little family secret  #1.

What if collectors really did learn to spot fakes and stop buying them? Then they could apply that same knowledge and experience to all their buying and would no longer be a milk cow for TPGs. We wouldn't want that now would we?---Dirty little family secret #2.